Friday, April 11, 2008

"PRAIRIE JUSTICE," SAM REDMAN? I THINK NOT! UPDATED!!!


UPDATE #2

For those who have blogs and are concerned about hacking, HTTrack, which Sam Redman mentioned in his most recent post on LCF, is excellent blog back-up software. It creates a mirror of your blog on your hard drive. Here is the link: HTTrack Website Copier

UPDATE#1

As I wrote in my comment yesterday morning (April 11/08 @ 8:21 a.m. ) which is posted below, I found it rather curious that Sam had saved so many Kimkins files to his samredman website.

So this morning, as I was rechecking those files, it dawned me as I looked at the URL that I posted yesterday morning (http://samredman.com/kimkins/www.kimkins.com/) that those files are saved to a mirror site of Kimkins, hosted on Sam's website. WTH???

And the other thing that popped out at me as I viewed the gifs was this one @
http://samredman.com/kimkins/www.kimkins.com/modules/mod_wl/del-after12.jpg

Here is the GIF:

What I found interesting is the saved file name: "...del_after."

How would Sam would know SingingLass's real name is Delaney after his statements that he only recently stumbled across the Kimkins story? Or could it be that when saving the Kimkins.con website to his files, that was the name Heidi attached to that gif?

So, Sam, would you kindly indulge my curiosity and explain why you’ve copied all the Kimkins.con gifs, templates, etc? Are they to be used, perhaps, on a new diet website, a la Magic Chicken? Or have you saved the entire Kimkin.con website for future use by Heidi?

Just wonderin'...

To check out all the gifs, templates, etc., saved by Sam click on the links below:

http://samredman.com/kimkins/www.kimkins.com/templates/ja_antares/images/

http://samredman.com/kimkins/www.kimkins.com/images/

http://samredman.com/kimkins/www.kimkins.com/images/stories/

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UPDATE #2

I was just checking out the recent posts of anti-kk bloggers and came across these great posts re Sam Redman. Check them out!

http://mariasol-mariasol.blogspot.com/2008/04/kimkins-hacked.html

http://yustyucky.wordpress.com/2008/04/09/the-program/

http://prudentiablog.blogspot.com/2008/04/devils-advocate.html

~~~~~~~~~~


Being a cowgirl myself from the Stampede City on the great Canadian Prairie, Sam Redman's "prairie justice" comment on the Fascination thread brought back fond memories for me. It seems like only yesterday I downed a few shooters myself in the old Palliser Hotel.


Below is a picture of my three brothers and me all decked out for the Calgary Stampede. Aren't those white socks and black shoes smokin'? And could that skirt be hiked up any higher?



Here is Sam Redman's post on LCF where he refers to "prairie justice" :

"Well, like my first post on this thread said... I was intrigued when I first saw a video on one of the tube sites about the Kimkins fiasco and so, I began doing some Google searches. The story became more fascinating when I discovered that behind a simple fraudulent sales promotion was a internet posting vendetta (now that's not necessarily a bad thing). If those conducting a vendetta are truly on the side of righteousness, I offer no condemnation. As Barry Goldwater said, "Moderation in the pursuit of justice is no virtue."

But, it was the behind the scenes story of the campaign, being engineered by disgruntled internet forum posters, which struck a harmonic chord with me, because I have seen this phenomenon before (in many other forum situations) and I have studied the strange dynamics of similarly bizarre sequences of forum events for years. I have been posting on boards since the seventies (beginning on the Commodore 64, using Compuserve, which was like a forerunner to the internet and today's bulletin boards) and from way back then, I have ofttimes explored very similar forum situations, where strange and often unusually intense relationships form between people (who are actually geographically distant strangers to each other) anonymously hiding behind unique posting pseudonyms, but where behind the scenes plots and "take over," as well as, "take down" plans unfold and where loyalties are broken and revenge is sought. Hatred often builds to such very intense levels it sometimes has even resulted in assaults and even murder. I have participated in a few boards, where I saw it happening and where it increased to an insane, mad frenzy (years ago, the very first "big brother" tv show boards had fighting groups, which were something to behold... one fray resulted in a shooting between members of opposing boards). On smaller boards, the sociology of the fighting factions can be tracked, until you can often observe the "tipping point" at which a board has been entirely taken over by a group with special interests or bias or prejudice (much like these Kimmer threads), where no discussion or dissent is allowed unless a poster agrees with the majority (anyone else is shouted down). That's why people who are interested in real dialog, which actually explores a topic, will soon leave that kind of environment to find more fertile territory for their intellectual exercise. There are numerous examples of these board "coup 'd etats" taking place and most of them result in boards being closed or becoming merely ongoing chat threads (almost always characterized by frequent one or two line postings) with posters getting meaner and more spiteful about the groups' common enemies (it's always nice if there are warring boards).

I had spent some time over the past few years posting a bit on the Natalee Holloway case. I always like to take the "innocent until proven guilty" stance and argue against the "wild west, hang 'em high, neck-tie party" crowd, who believe in punishment for anyone merely accused of a crime. I first posted on ScaredMonkeys site, until it became one of those places dedicated to a single belief, where dissent wasn't permitted. I then started my own dot com info site called Scrux and had a discussion board there, which was open to any view... but, eventually I closed that board (even though at the time it had 1000 visitors a day), when it started showing those signs of "group takeover." I didn't want to fool with that drama. But through all of this, I have continued to puzzle over the dynamics of forums and why they all seem to go bad eventually. This is what was so interesting to me about the Kimkins scandal... isn't so much the fraud or the phony pictures and testimonials or even the lawsuit per se, but instead, how it was created through a forum (lowcarbfriends) by a prolific poster (19,000 of 'em) and then spun off as a commercial enterprise, which then used as its own kernel, a forum, finally experiencing its eventual internal come-apart, because of poor administration in how to deal with that same old thing, "those who didn't agree." Then, we have the offended ones banding together here on lowcarbfriends with their common bond of revenge and a kind of a prairie justice mentality which, as I read the threads, appeared to have a lot in common with the distorted logic of those "high 'em high" crowds, which I have seen many times before.

So, I was motivated to study the case, gathering all the facts I could from a neutral viewpoint and then evaluating all I found with an open mind to see if my analysis of it would bear any contrast to prevailing views. I really wasn't concerned whether what I discovered or reasoned would be a contrary position when I was done or if I would be marching in step with the crowd. I was only interested in my honest take on all I would consider about the circumstances of the situation. Therefore, my postings have primarily been done as an exercise to see, if, in spite of the resolute commonalty of a group's closed mindedness, whether they might be communicatively responsive to an new, fresh view from an outsider. What I have posted... has been the steps in that exploration.

Could all this curiosity result in a book someday on this peculiar phenomenon of the dynamics of internet forums? Maybe. I have certainly kicked around the book idea and I am collecting all my musings on the subject (covering about five of these board situations from a six year period)... just really as a hobby (I have other writing chores) and maybe someday it will be a book. I don't know....might just be too boring to publish.
__________________
All my posts in one place: http:// samredman . com/kimkinsposts"


(BOLDING & UNDERSCORING MINE)





Well, rather than go into a rant about Sam's ludicrous "prairie justice" comment, I've decided to take Yucky up on her very wise suggestion and consolidate all comments relating to Sam in this post.

Here are the comments posted so far...

"Medusa said...
And speaking of Heidi, do you think she's Sam?"

April 10, 2008 11:25 PM

~~~~~~~~~~

"MrsMenopausal said...
Hmmm, Heidi=Sam? I don't think so.

Heidi likes a lot of attention and to be considered an authority on everything. Oh, wait. Ummm.

Nah, Heidi makes use of many pseudonyms in her verbose displays of ... uh, eh. Scratch that.

No way. Heidi is her own biggest fan and ... errr, crap.

Can I get back to you on this?"

April 10, 2008 11:58 PM"

~~~~~~~~~~

"Medusa said...
LOL, MrsM. You're breaking me up here :^) There are a lot of similarities, no?

I'm thinking that if Sam isn't Heidi then he is someone who has followed this story for a long, long time.

Yesterday, I couldn't remember the URL to his "writings" that he posted on LCF so I typed in this:

http://samredman.com/kimkins/www.kimkins.com/

Check out all the sub-files and you'll see he was busy saving the strangest things from KK on April 7th.

The other thing I can't wrap my head around is the fact that if he saw the Insider Exclusive video (which wasn't posted until the wee hours of March 30th) that he refers to in his first posting, how on earth could he have read and absorbed ALL the FWK threads and ALL the anti-KK blogs before his first post on LCF. That would be a pretty monumental task, unless he's taken the Evelyn Wood speed-reading course.

IMO, he knows too much to have come this late to the party."

April 11, 2008 8:21 AM

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"MrsMenopausal said...
Well, well, well. Very interesting. Very interesting, indeed.

Yes, I agree. It's a lot of info in a short period of time. It doesn't make sense.

If he's been involved for longer than he claims, I wonder what he gains by representing himself as a newcomer to it all."

April 11, 2008 10:46 AM


~~~~~~~~~~

"Mariasol said...
MrsM - I rarely LoL in my office at work but this cracked me up:

"Hmmm, Heidi=Sam? I don't think so.

Heidi likes a lot of attention and to be considered an authority on everything. Oh, wait. Ummm.

Nah, Heidi makes use of many pseudonyms in her verbose displays of ... uh, eh. Scratch that.

No way. Heidi is her own biggest fan and ... errr, crap.

Can I get back to you on this?"

April 11, 2008 12:36 PM

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"Sheridan said...
"IMO, he knows too much to have come this late to the party."

I think so, too..."

April 11, 2008 7:14 PM


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"Yucky said...
Fascinating information Medusa! hmmm ...

hey would you mind opening up a post for the LCFSam discussion? Lots of new info coming in from various sources & we hate to clutter up your excellent Diabetes post!

Note to Mrs.M -- lol! You are one funny lady!"

April 11, 2008 11:14 PM

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"theTRUTH said...
Ducky = Sam Redman"

April 11, 2008 5:44 PM


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"Yucky said...
wth? T, do you really think so or are you just being a controversialist :D"

April 11, 2008 11:17 PM

~~~~~~~~~~

End of comments. Carry on!



LINK:
http://www.lowcarbfriends.com/bbs/10163570-post3210.html
http://www.sofacinema.co.uk/guardian/images/products/1/2481-large.jpg

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29 comments:

Yucky said...

THanks Medusa! Interesting discussion.

awww is that really a photo of you with your little brothers? How cute!

Medusa said...

That was a great idea, Yucky, to move those comments. Thanks!

Yep, that's me and my little brothers in Calgary. Aren't they adorable?

mariasol said...

Sam Redman hacked Kimkins! Or at least it looks that way. Check out my blog or samredman.com/kimkins.

LoL.

Yucky said...

hey Medusa, feel free to delete my comment containing the text of LCFSam's "prairie justice" speech.

Excellent sleuthing everybody!

Medusa said...

Done, Yucky! Thanks :^)

MrsMenopausal said...

Medusa, you and your brothers are too adorable!

You made me read it all instead of the quick Evelyn "Woodless" scan technique I've adopted when faced with the task of reading yet another SR chronicle. I don't forgive you. ;-)

IMO,it's near impossible for SR to achieve the unbiased perspective he claims.

Just take into consideration SR's previous experience with the multitude of forums he claims to have witnessed and participated in.

His previous experience with controversial forum subjects muddies the waters of objectivity. It's obvious in his references and descriptions of the behaviors of those forum members.

SR is articulate, gifted with a command of the written word, but being able to wrap up assumptions in a big, shiny bow of eloquence doesn't make them true.
JMO

My blog: Weighing The Facts

BamaGal said...

I do think it is quite odd that Sam is collecting all this stuff. He is apparently someone else with a computer and too much time on their hands.

Does he know Heidi---is he Heidi?

Who knows at this point.

As for the name of the image file for SL. That is the name of it on Heidi's site. All he did is load it on his server. Why? Who the hell knows.

Medusa said...

Thanks, MrsM! That picture of my brothers is one of my favourites. Unfortunately, my little brother in the middle, Alan, died in 1989. Broke my heart.

And speaking of "articulate" and "gifted with a command of the written word," your comment rocks, MrsM. Plus you're one of the funniest people I've ever met. Smart AND funny...what a combo :^)

Medusa said...

Bama, you're absolutely correct about the name on SL's image file.

Sam will shortly come to realize that his every move is being watched.

And I'd go so far as to speculate that there's a lot more to Sam Redman than first appears on the surface.

MrsMenopausal said...

I'm so sorry to hear about your little brother. {{{{}}}}

I had a wordy rebuttal all typed out but have erased it and decided to go with my old Aunt M's advice instead and say thank you for the compliment. The feeling is mutual. :)

She was all about fashion and manners. I'm wearing sweats today so I'm going with manners to counterbalance the attire. ;)

Medusa said...

Mariasol, the strangest thing happened. Your comment just arrived on my blog but the time of your comment shows as 8:44 a.m. Hmmmm.

Great post on your blog! I've linked to it on this post.

The waters muddier and muddier every day, don't they?

Medusa said...

MrsM, thank you for your condolences. Hugs.

Alan was an amazing guy with a brilliant sense of humour who travelled the world of the rich and famous and lived more in his short lifetime than most do in 80 years.

Two weeks before he died, he arranged for the clergy of almost every faith to visit him in his hospital room. With each visit he "converted" to the religion of the day.

At the end, he was a Catholic, Presbyterian, Anglican, United, Lutheran, and a few others I can't remember at the moment.

Because he was an agnostic, when I asked him why was going through these bedside religious conversions, he laughed and said, "I'm just hedging my bets." :^)

Prior to his death, Alan had been the longest living AIDS survivor in Australia.

MrsMenopausal said...

Wow. He sounds like an amazing man, Medusa.

I L'dOL about "just hedging my bets." Smart man.

Medusa said...

That comment of his broke me up too, MrsM :^)

Alan was such a funny guy, and even during his long and truly agonizing death never once lost his sense of humour.

What was especially wonderful is that he bequeathed thousands and thousands of dollars to the renowned St. Vincent's Hospital in Sydney, Australia, where he had been one of their first AIDS patients, for research and to provide financial assistance not only to the hospital but to other AIDS patients as well.

mariasol said...

LoL at the 8:44 comment. I thought you had rejected it.
I have been lectured by the TRUTH and others that this was not a hack but a clone. Of course, I have to believe the TRUTH, but to make sure I looked into it and verified that they were right.
But WHY would Sam Redman do such a thing? To study it he says. Study it for what?

MrsMenopausal said...

I'm so sorry that he suffered.

What a wonderful thing for him to do, donating his money to help others. I really admire that.

Mayberryfan said...

I've got a little question: A few days ago, I googled "sam redman" and found many pro-Kimmer comments on ALC. Someone on the FWK thread asked him about it, he pretended to know nothing, then poof - they vanished.

Hmmmm? Why do you suppose that happened?

Medusa said...

{{{MrsM}}} I admired that too.

Medusa said...

Mayberry :^) Sounds like we have a little post-cleansing going on, doesn't it?

How interesting! Bet there are some ducks who got screen shots :^)

Anonymous said...

So, I googled Sam Redman, and came up with something from the "Natalee Case " Discussion: http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=2212.msg288169#msg288169
(scroll down a bit)...
The posters there don't like him (not even a little)and say he posts under other names(Roger, SRedman) I went to the website reported to be his (safetravels.org) and it was blank except for text "Have a nice day".. Just like how he ended his last (one can hope) LCF post! Creepy...

-Concerned (not sure why I can't publish using this name anymore!)

Medusa said...

Concerned...thanks for the update :^)

I've heard through the grapevine that there's a lot more on the web about Sam and it's not all rosy.

Please keep us all updated with any other tidbits that you find. Thanks!

mariasol said...

Sam Redman registered safetravels.org shortly after the REAL Natalee fund raiser site (safetravels.net) was created. Sam wrote an Amazon book report where he promoted his site as the official fund raiser. He also left a comment on FOX news to the same effect. Surely this was a scam attempt as he was not affiliated with the dot net site.

Medusa said...

Well, well, well, Mariasol, isn't that interesting!

So Sam isn't squeaky clean. Can you spell "scammer."

Seems he and Heidi have something in common.

Thanks so much for your comment. I've heard there are a lot of ducks doing some serious digging on Sam so I'm sure there will be many more revelations shortly :^)

Anonymous said...

I'm not fond of Sam Redman at all... Anyone that casts aspersions on and attacks Jeannessa and John Tiedt is in the same category as Heidi, IMO.

If you read his last entry to "kimkins post" (on his Sam Redman website), he states regarding the Kimkins lawsuit:

"Sounds like the solicitation for people to join the lawsuit is done under false pretenses. Where they are saying; "Join the lawsuit and stop the fraud, shut her site down, stop her from giving false health advice;" none of those are truthful statements. What they should be saying is, "Help Jeanessa Fenderson, the lead plaintiff (and maybe a few of the other lawsuit bloggers), get a large settlement."

MrsMenopausal said...

Mariasol.... Wow, how interesting. It sure doesn't sound like someone on the up and up.

Anonymous said: If you read his last entry to "kimkins post" (on his Sam Redman website), he states regarding the Kimkins lawsuit: "Sounds like the solicitation for people to join the lawsuit is done under false pretenses. Where they are saying; "Join the lawsuit and stop the fraud, shut her site down, stop her from giving false health advice;" none of those are truthful statements. What they should be saying is, "Help Jeanessa Fenderson, the lead plaintiff (and maybe a few of the other lawsuit bloggers), get a large settlement."

IMO SR is attention seeking. He seems to need it desperately. He linked to his own LCF posts in other LCF posts when he didn't get many responses to them. It looks like another attempt to rile in hopes that someone will call him out and, once again, draw attention to him. I don't think anyone even answered his last LCF post.

My guess is that's gotta sting an ego that size.

Medusa said...

mrsmenopausal said...
"My guess is that's gotta sting an ego that size."

An ego the size of Texas :^)

Yucky said...

{{{Medusa}}}

Medusa said...

(((Yucky))) Thanks, hon.

theTRUTH said...

Prairie Justice? Thats Texas talk. Hot in TX this time of year Sam?