TOM SPANKS THE DUCKS...THEN BACKPEDALS !!! [AND THEN GETS SNARKY...SEE UPDATE!]

In what may have been a splash of misogyny and a spike in testosterone, Tom, owner of Netrition and Big Kahuna of Low Carb Friends (LCF), brings down the paddle on the posters on the Fascination with Kimmer thread at LCF...and then starts backpedaling!

It all started on April 28th, 2008, when he posted the following:

(Click to enlarge)

"Tom
Administrator

Why the fascination with Kimmer? #16

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Welcome to: Why the fascination with Kimmer? #16

As a reminder, please be respectful of dissenting views and please avoid personal insults of others - including the subject of these threads. Thank you. "

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Well, to put it mildly, I found that post just a tad unusual.

And then Tom posts this further admonishment on May 12, 2008:

(Click to enlarge)

"Tom
Administrator

Please try to stay on topic in this thread. Many members are complaining that they are interested in keeping up, but don't have time to read through all the chit chat. Use other threads for other topics. Thank you. "

~~~~~~~~~~

And then, after being taken to task by LosingToLive, Tom does the big backpedal:

(Click to enlarge)

"Tom
Administrator

Quote:
Originally Posted by LosingToLive

Oops, Sorry Tom .

When we are "goaded" to respond, sometimes we ( I ) can't help it.

We have all worked very hard to get to thread number 17. We don't mean to take this thread in another direction, we're just making friends.*gasp*

Yes, it’s important to stay on topic but we have all worked side by side for so long, it’s like a family reunion.

We understand what your’re saying, and we know that some people only have time for the "results". We are the ones that are bringing the "results", sometimes we get carried away with our hard work.

I for one will not clutter this thread with friendly talk; we don’t want this thread to disappear. I just don’t understand why things have changed.

I don't want people complaining to you while they are suffering. If they are having such a hard time with this thread, it must be pretty “traumatic for them to contact you. * I *(me) apologize. I’m not trying to be a jerk (sometimes it happens). I understand how someone wants "details only", but we are the ones that went out and *got those details*.

Tom, It is your board ,and we will abide by your rules. I wish I would have known that the rules change. WE have worked our butts off to get this info to the lawyers, etc. NO, we weren’t always on topic, but we kicked butt. Good job Ducks !

If I disappear, ask around and someone will be able to contact me.

Take care Ducks, you're work is important. Stand tall, and keep going. We only wished that someone would have dropped the “details” in our laps, instead *we worked for them*.

LL"

No rules changed. I simply reminded everyone to try to stay on topic for the benefit of everyone that would like to read the thread. That doesn't mean to only post "results". I understand that friendships are made and there will naturally be some posts unrelated to the topic, but I just ask you to consider whether some of the comments could be posted in other more appropriate forums or threads or in a PM.

It actually doesn't matter much to me since I don't read all the posts in these threads, but some people that would like to are simply unable to keep up because of the large volume of off-topic posts and have expressed some frustration.

How do the rest of you feel about it? Do you think it's insulting to ask everyone to try not to stray so far from the topic of the thread? "

~~~~~~~~~~

Well, Tom, you've taken a page out of Heidi's book. And guess what? It IS too late to take that back.

These posters are your bread and butter, lining your pockets with silver by purchasing from your company, Netrition.

It appears the damage is done, Tom, as there is much talk of a mass exodus from LCF because of the continual hand-slapping and admonishments by yourself and other admins.

UPDATE!

And in a fit of pique this afternoon (Tuesday, May 13/08), Tom next posts the following:

(Click to enlarge)

"Quote:
Originally Posted by Mayberryfan
Linc/Lou ~

I'm not under the impression that anyone thinks Dee is OT. It's that some of us, myself most definitely included, have been reprimanded for making very mild, off-color remarks about Heidi and gotten a no-no note for it. Whereas, people, such as Dee, and others can come in with what appears to be an intent to stir up trouble, call the Ducks "haters" and other such nonsense and they seem free to say whatever they want for as long as they want. To me, THAT'S the crux of the discussion here about what's OT and what isnt. "

"Another complaint about this? You were simply reminded by an admin of the terms of service because of your post: "Every gal needs a little "sea man" in her life." That's all. We don't want posts like that here. "

AND NEXT THIS:

(Click to enlarge)

"Quote:
Originally Posted by Mayberryfan
Whereas, people, such as Dee, and others can come in with what appears to be an intent to stir up trouble, call the Ducks "haters" and other such nonsense and they seem free to say whatever they want for as long as they want. To me, THAT'S the crux of the discussion here about what's OT and what isnt."

"And we respect Dee's right to express her opinion especially since she was being talked about here. Do you feel she should be banned from the site because you don't agree with her - or would it make more sense to respectfully address her concerns as some others have done here. Instead you laughed and encouraged posts that tell her to not "let the door hit your A## on the way out." What type of reaction do you expect when people talk to you like that?"

AND THEN MAYBERRY RESPONDS:

(Click to enlarge)

"Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom
And we respect Dee's right to express her opinion especially since she was being talked about here. Do you feel she should be banned from the site because you don't agree with her - or would it make more sense to respectfully address her concerns as some others have done here. Instead you laughed and encouraged posts that tell her to not "let the door hit your A## on the way out." What type of reaction do you expect when people talk to you like that? "

"I didn't POST that Tom, I merely laughed in response to it. I don't have a problem with Dee posting her side of things. She has a right to express her side of the issue. As a matter of fact, I've had very few dealings with Dee. My problem is with the fact that lately we don't seem to be able to make any little off-color remark about Heidi. That's my issue!

Hey, it's your board and you can certainly run it as you see fit. I'm not someone who complains about other's posts. I've only complained about one person here and fortunately he chose to leave us on his own. I don't TRY to cause trouble, KWIM? "

AND AGAIN MAYBERRY RESPONDS:

(Click to enlarge)

"Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom
Another complaint about this? You were simply reminded by an admin of the terms of service because of your post: "Every gal needs a little "sea man" in her life." That's all. We don't want posts like that here."

"Tom, et al.,

If anyone was offended by that little joke, I honestly apologize. It was not intention to offend anyone (except for Heidi). It was simply meant to be a play on words. "
~~~~~~~~~~

Actually, Mayberry, I would have told Tom to...

And a note to all my Canadian readers:

There's a wonderful Canadian online site, Low Carb Grocery, where you can order all of your favourite low-carb products. I highly recommend this company. You can check it out by clicking on the link on the right-hand side bar of my blog or on the logo below:

To read my previous posts on Tom, please click on these links:

OUR MAN IN HIDING: GARY FONTAINE of KIMKINS

A SHOCKING EDICT FROM TOM "THE DON" RODDY OF LOW CARB FRIENDS

LCF MODERATORS/ADMINISTRATORS PERPETUATED KIMKINS/KIMMER FRAUD

LINKS:

http://www.lowcarbfriends.com/bbs/10163619-post1.html

http://www.lowcarbfriends.com/bbs/10308043-post239.html

http://www.lowcarbfriends.com/bbs/10308043-post239.html

(Check the thread for the updated posts)

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"PRAIRIE JUSTICE," SAM REDMAN? I THINK NOT! UPDATED!!!

UPDATE #2

For those who have blogs and are concerned about hacking, HTTrack, which Sam Redman mentioned in his most recent post on LCF, is excellent blog back-up software. It creates a mirror of your blog on your hard drive. Here is the link: HTTrack Website Copier

UPDATE#1

As I wrote in my comment yesterday morning (April 11/08 @ 8:21 a.m. ) which is posted below, I found it rather curious that Sam had saved so many Kimkins files to his samredman website.

So this morning, as I was rechecking those files, it dawned me as I looked at the URL that I posted yesterday morning (http://samredman.com/kimkins/www.kimkins.com/) that those files are saved to a mirror site of Kimkins, hosted on Sam's website. WTH???

And the other thing that popped out at me as I viewed the gifs was this one @
http://samredman.com/kimkins/www.kimkins.com/modules/mod_wl/del-after12.jpg

Here is the GIF:

What I found interesting is the saved file name: "...del_after."

How would Sam would know SingingLass's real name is Delaney after his statements that he only recently stumbled across the Kimkins story? Or could it be that when saving the Kimkins.con website to his files, that was the name Heidi attached to that gif?

So, Sam, would you kindly indulge my curiosity and explain why you’ve copied all the Kimkins.con gifs, templates, etc? Are they to be used, perhaps, on a new diet website, a la Magic Chicken? Or have you saved the entire Kimkin.con website for future use by Heidi?

Just wonderin'...

To check out all the gifs, templates, etc., saved by Sam click on the links below:

http://samredman.com/kimkins/www.kimkins.com/templates/ja_antares/images/

http://samredman.com/kimkins/www.kimkins.com/images/

http://samredman.com/kimkins/www.kimkins.com/images/stories/

~~~~~~~~~~
UPDATE #2

I was just checking out the recent posts of anti-kk bloggers and came across these great posts re Sam Redman. Check them out!

http://mariasol-mariasol.blogspot.com/2008/04/kimkins-hacked.html

http://yustyucky.wordpress.com/2008/04/09/the-program/

http://prudentiablog.blogspot.com/2008/04/devils-advocate.html

~~~~~~~~~~

Being a cowgirl myself from the Stampede City on the great Canadian Prairie, Sam Redman's "prairie justice" comment on the Fascination thread brought back fond memories for me. It seems like only yesterday I downed a few shooters myself in the old Palliser Hotel.


Below is a picture of my three brothers and me all decked out for the Calgary Stampede. Aren't those white socks and black shoes smokin'? And could that skirt be hiked up any higher?

Here is Sam Redman's post on LCF where he refers to "prairie justice" :

"Well, like my first post on this thread said... I was intrigued when I first saw a video on one of the tube sites about the Kimkins fiasco and so, I began doing some Google searches. The story became more fascinating when I discovered that behind a simple fraudulent sales promotion was a internet posting vendetta (now that's not necessarily a bad thing). If those conducting a vendetta are truly on the side of righteousness, I offer no condemnation. As Barry Goldwater said, "Moderation in the pursuit of justice is no virtue."

But, it was the behind the scenes story of the campaign, being engineered by disgruntled internet forum posters, which struck a harmonic chord with me, because I have seen this phenomenon before (in many other forum situations) and I have studied the strange dynamics of similarly bizarre sequences of forum events for years. I have been posting on boards since the seventies (beginning on the Commodore 64, using Compuserve, which was like a forerunner to the internet and today's bulletin boards) and from way back then, I have ofttimes explored very similar forum situations, where strange and often unusually intense relationships form between people (who are actually geographically distant strangers to each other) anonymously hiding behind unique posting pseudonyms, but where behind the scenes plots and "take over," as well as, "take down" plans unfold and where loyalties are broken and revenge is sought. Hatred often builds to such very intense levels it sometimes has even resulted in assaults and even murder. I have participated in a few boards, where I saw it happening and where it increased to an insane, mad frenzy (years ago, the very first "big brother" tv show boards had fighting groups, which were something to behold... one fray resulted in a shooting between members of opposing boards). On smaller boards, the sociology of the fighting factions can be tracked, until you can often observe the "tipping point" at which a board has been entirely taken over by a group with special interests or bias or prejudice (much like these Kimmer threads), where no discussion or dissent is allowed unless a poster agrees with the majority (anyone else is shouted down). That's why people who are interested in real dialog, which actually explores a topic, will soon leave that kind of environment to find more fertile territory for their intellectual exercise. There are numerous examples of these board "coup 'd etats" taking place and most of them result in boards being closed or becoming merely ongoing chat threads (almost always characterized by frequent one or two line postings) with posters getting meaner and more spiteful about the groups' common enemies (it's always nice if there are warring boards).

I had spent some time over the past few years posting a bit on the Natalee Holloway case. I always like to take the "innocent until proven guilty" stance and argue against the "wild west, hang 'em high, neck-tie party" crowd, who believe in punishment for anyone merely accused of a crime. I first posted on ScaredMonkeys site, until it became one of those places dedicated to a single belief, where dissent wasn't permitted. I then started my own dot com info site called Scrux and had a discussion board there, which was open to any view... but, eventually I closed that board (even though at the time it had 1000 visitors a day), when it started showing those signs of "group takeover." I didn't want to fool with that drama. But through all of this, I have continued to puzzle over the dynamics of forums and why they all seem to go bad eventually. This is what was so interesting to me about the Kimkins scandal... isn't so much the fraud or the phony pictures and testimonials or even the lawsuit per se, but instead, how it was created through a forum (lowcarbfriends) by a prolific poster (19,000 of 'em) and then spun off as a commercial enterprise, which then used as its own kernel, a forum, finally experiencing its eventual internal come-apart, because of poor administration in how to deal with that same old thing, "those who didn't agree." Then, we have the offended ones banding together here on lowcarbfriends with their common bond of revenge and a kind of a prairie justice mentality which, as I read the threads, appeared to have a lot in common with the distorted logic of those "high 'em high" crowds, which I have seen many times before.

So, I was motivated to study the case, gathering all the facts I could from a neutral viewpoint and then evaluating all I found with an open mind to see if my analysis of it would bear any contrast to prevailing views. I really wasn't concerned whether what I discovered or reasoned would be a contrary position when I was done or if I would be marching in step with the crowd. I was only interested in my honest take on all I would consider about the circumstances of the situation. Therefore, my postings have primarily been done as an exercise to see, if, in spite of the resolute commonalty of a group's closed mindedness, whether they might be communicatively responsive to an new, fresh view from an outsider. What I have posted... has been the steps in that exploration.

Could all this curiosity result in a book someday on this peculiar phenomenon of the dynamics of internet forums? Maybe. I have certainly kicked around the book idea and I am collecting all my musings on the subject (covering about five of these board situations from a six year period)... just really as a hobby (I have other writing chores) and maybe someday it will be a book. I don't know....might just be too boring to publish.
__________________
All my posts in one place: http:// samredman . com/kimkinsposts"

(BOLDING & UNDERSCORING MINE)




Well, rather than go into a rant about Sam's ludicrous "prairie justice" comment, I've decided to take Yucky up on her very wise suggestion and consolidate all comments relating to Sam in this post.

Here are the comments posted so far...

"Medusa said...
And speaking of Heidi, do you think she's Sam?"

April 10, 2008 11:25 PM

~~~~~~~~~~

"MrsMenopausal said...
Hmmm, Heidi=Sam? I don't think so.

Heidi likes a lot of attention and to be considered an authority on everything. Oh, wait. Ummm.

Nah, Heidi makes use of many pseudonyms in her verbose displays of ... uh, eh. Scratch that.

No way. Heidi is her own biggest fan and ... errr, crap.

Can I get back to you on this?"

April 10, 2008 11:58 PM"
~~~~~~~~~~

"Medusa said...
LOL, MrsM. You're breaking me up here :^) There are a lot of similarities, no?

I'm thinking that if Sam isn't Heidi then he is someone who has followed this story for a long, long time.

Yesterday, I couldn't remember the URL to his "writings" that he posted on LCF so I typed in this:

http://samredman.com/kimkins/www.kimkins.com/

Check out all the sub-files and you'll see he was busy saving the strangest things from KK on April 7th.

The other thing I can't wrap my head around is the fact that if he saw the Insider Exclusive video (which wasn't posted until the wee hours of March 30th) that he refers to in his first posting, how on earth could he have read and absorbed ALL the FWK threads and ALL the anti-KK blogs before his first post on LCF. That would be a pretty monumental task, unless he's taken the Evelyn Wood speed-reading course.

IMO, he knows too much to have come this late to the party."

April 11, 2008 8:21 AM

~~~~~~~~~~

"MrsMenopausal said...
Well, well, well. Very interesting. Very interesting, indeed.

Yes, I agree. It's a lot of info in a short period of time. It doesn't make sense.

If he's been involved for longer than he claims, I wonder what he gains by representing himself as a newcomer to it all."

April 11, 2008 10:46 AM

~~~~~~~~~~

"Mariasol said...
MrsM - I rarely LoL in my office at work but this cracked me up:

"Hmmm, Heidi=Sam? I don't think so.

Heidi likes a lot of attention and to be considered an authority on everything. Oh, wait. Ummm.

Nah, Heidi makes use of many pseudonyms in her verbose displays of ... uh, eh. Scratch that.

No way. Heidi is her own biggest fan and ... errr, crap.

Can I get back to you on this?"

April 11, 2008 12:36 PM

~~~~~~~~~~

"Sheridan said...
"IMO, he knows too much to have come this late to the party."

I think so, too..."

April 11, 2008 7:14 PM

~~~~~~~~~~

"Yucky said...
Fascinating information Medusa! hmmm ...

hey would you mind opening up a post for the LCFSam discussion? Lots of new info coming in from various sources & we hate to clutter up your excellent Diabetes post!

Note to Mrs.M -- lol! You are one funny lady!"

April 11, 2008 11:14 PM

~~~~~~~~~~

"theTRUTH said...
Ducky = Sam Redman"

April 11, 2008 5:44 PM

~~~~~~~~~~

"Yucky said...
wth? T, do you really think so or are you just being a controversialist :D"

April 11, 2008 11:17 PM

~~~~~~~~~~

End of comments. Carry on!



LINK:
http://www.lowcarbfriends.com/bbs/10163570-post3210.html
http://www.sofacinema.co.uk/guardian/images/products/1/2481-large.jpg

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A SHOCKING EDICT FROM TOM "THE DON" RODDY OF LOW CARB FRIENDS...

Half-awake this morning, I thought I'd catch up on the Fascination with Kimmer thread on Low Carb Friends.

As I read the first post in Thread 16 from Tom Roddy, Administrator of LCF and the owner of Netrition, my eyes popped out of my head.

Read carefully what he said:

Tom
Administrator

Join Date: Feb 2003
Posts: 4,623
Blog Entries: 2
Gallery: Tom
-->
Why the fascination with Kimmer? #16

Welcome to: Why the fascination with Kimmer? #16As a reminder, please be respectful of dissenting views and please avoid personal insults of others - including the subject of these threads. Thank you."

Say what???

Heidi Diaz is able to personally ruin the health of thousands of people with her starvation diet but the posters on LCF are no longer able to throw barbs at her? Give me a freakin' break.

Tom Roddy, as owner of Netrition, has had his personal fortunes largely enriched by the continued support of posters on the thread, who buy their low-carb products from his company. The very reason for the thread's existence is Heidi Diaz/Kimmer and his now censuring the posters seems just a tad disingenuous to me. Tom, be careful not to cut off your nose to spite your face.

Having been banned from LCF (including the blocking of my IP), I can speak from experience when I say that ALL posters (even the favourites of Tom, Dottie, and Cheri) had better be VERY careful now not to disparage the character or form of Heidi Diaz/Kimmer.

The LCF mods love the ban buttton as much as Heidi, so, as Ivana loves to say, "Fair warning, ladies."

In the interests of free speech, I will henceforth open my blog to anyone who wants to rant about anything.

Just post a comment on this blog post and let the free flow of conversation ensue. I will not edit or delete comments.

When the comments become too lengthy I will start a new post...just like Tom, but without edicts or admonitions.

LINK:
http://www.lowcarbfriends.com/bbs/kimkins/550336-why-fascination-kimmer-16-a.html

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THE HACKING OF YUCKY'S BLOG and YUCKY'S APOLOGY

I just finished reading Yucky's umpteenth apology for the fake hacking of her blog.

Yucky did not act alone in this matter. I was not only complicit but the driving force in posting about the hacking.

Unlike Yucky, I will not apologize. It was a joke, pure and simple.

To refresh your memory, the hacking post is below.

Since this post seems to still be in the hearts and minds of many, please leave a comment and tell me how you were personally affected by the fake hacking and/or how it affected the lawsuit. I'm all ears.

And please spare me comments saying that you felt deceived, like Heidi deceived you, and felt that you could no longer trust people anymore. Whatever.


LINK: http://yustyucky.wordpress.com/2008/03/16/apology/


THE HACKING POST (January 7/08):


A startling development in the disappearance of a blog post by Yucky and the boys this morning on Kimkins Exhausted...


I have it from an extremely reliable source that the BLOG WAS HACKED !!! Yes, HACKED !!!

I have been unable to contact Yucky and the boys to find out what the rest of their post said. They're probably hunkered down in some duck blind, greasing up their rifles and putting on their hip waders and red plaid jackets. This ain't gonna be pretty when Yucky and the boys find the perp.

Now, what on earth would cause a hacker to go in and remove a single post by Yucky and the boys?

Well, let's take a look at the first part of the hacked post that arrived on my desk this morning via Google Alerts...

"Blowing in the wind

By yustyucky

Why is Amy continuing to promote Kimkins via her board & her youtube videos? How did the chicken lady really find out about Kimkins? Who really told Jeanessa that the fascination thread posters & anti-Kimkins bloggers are endangering ...

The Lighter Side of BadBad - http://yustyucky.wordpress.com "


Now, what words do you think followed "endangering" in Yucky's post? Any idea where Yucky and the boys were going with this post?


If you think you have the answer, or even a wild and/or unsubstantiated speculation, do tell. You can e-mail me at medusa_blog@hotmail.com . I have no idea where Yucky's post was going, and don't I hate not to be "in the know."

Now, if I were the hacker, I'd be very worried. Yucky sent me these photos years ago which I was able to lay my hands on today.

The first photo is Bob's wedding picture, and the others are the rest of Yucky's crew.









When Yucky and the boys get back from their hunt for the perp, I hope to hear from them to clear up this mystery. When I do, I'll let you know.

In the meantime, e-mail me your guesses on the missing words in Yucky's hacked post.

LINK TO KIMKINS EXHAUSTED:
http://yustyucky.wordpress.com/



LINKS TO PHOTOS:
http://3rednecktenors.com/email/NECK_news8a.htm
http://hypersonicbeams.blogspot.com/2005/09/neil-lynch.html
http://rat-hunter.com/

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FASTING A LA HEIDI DIAZ / KIMMER: WATER, WATER, EVERYWHERE...

...and not one ounce of truth from Kimmer:

Believe me, the only meaning of "fast" that Heidi Diaz is familiar with is how fast she can lighten your wallet and hide the money in some bogus bank account.

This was posted by wifezilla yesterday on LCF:

"How about this blast from the past where a woman complains to kimmer she is dizzy and kimmer tells her to cut her calories for a week??!?!?!?

Water Fasting...."

Well, knowing full well that Heidi Diaz has never fasted on water for more than 30 seconds, I checked the link and found these comments from Heidi to others at LCF who requested her advice on water fasting:

"If you're an experienced faster (as in not panicking about it), then you're already ahead of the game.

When I break a water fast (I just ended a 7 day yesterday), I do it with fresh or steamed veggies. Small amounts throughout the day, minimal fat ... have to have a pinch of butter on broccoli, LOL. I don't do fruit because of the ketosis factor.

You can lose a great deal on a water fast, 1 pound per day, but be ware of looking for a quick fix. Water fasting isn't providing any nutrients and if someone "cheats" with junk food, then what "good" has been accomplished for your body? I'm not saying this about you, just people in general.

I've done many 7 and 10 day fasts, a few 30 day, one 45 day and I do a 3 day once a month (Friday morning to Sunday afternoon) ... but I've been doing this since 1982."

Hahahaha! Yeah, whatever, Heidi.

"I wish I could do pure water, I just can't. I tried it once (that thread is in Past Amazing Posts) and I was miserable.So, I drink Fruit 2 0, diet soda, watered down Crystal Light, herbal tea (no sweetener). On my weekend fasts I also sip homemade veggie broth."

Yeah, water's a bitch, isn't it Heidi?

"I'm doing my weekly shopping this afternoon and I'm going to pick up some lemons. Great idea!"

Yeah, a little slice of lemon with the Cap'n IS good!

"You won't fall into the anorexic category if you're choosing to fast and not because you can't help yourself ... and as long as you've got enough body fat."

Oh, Heidi, your delving into dangerous territory here. Who died and made you the authority on anorexia? You are one scary chick.

"Still, I wouldn't do a 30 or 45 day water fast without a doctor's supervision. Why? I don't know, I just wouldn't recommend it."

WTH??? Heidi, you don't know WHY? Hello????

"You could even supplement with 2 smallish salads and still be under 500 calories with very quick weight loss."

There's that old "500 calories" bullshite again that Heidi's always spouting. Can we say "starvation"?

"What kind of ketosis? Based on what? How many days?"

Say what? Heidi, being in ketosis is like being pregnant...you either are or you aren't.

"My 45 day fast was when I was 21 (I'll be 48 in may)."

LMAO! Heidi on a 45-day fast EVER??? Ha!

"This is only about water fasting: I don't get the 'starving' feeling, but my stomach will grumble on some days and carbonated diet soda fixes that. And, as you point out, if you try to eat you feel nauseous.

It's probably only me, but when the grumbling happens I'm guaranteed a 2-3 pound loss the next day (always more than 1) and there will be something physically improved. One time it was my vision (usually blurry in the morning, suddenly clear as a bell), another time my leg skin became silky (ordinarily I'm a lizard w/o lotion).

Let's not forget to check our tongues. The window to your innards! If you hav a thick white or yellow coating, give yourself a big pat on the back ... you're giving your body the best tune-up available."

I think I'll pass on checking your forked tongue, Heidi.


You know, I have a serious concern about this thread of Heidi's on LCF. I hope that someone who is unfamiliar with the Kimkins scam doesn't stumble upon it and think Heidi Diaz is an expert on water fasting.

My concern is shared also by anipomoni who posted this yesterday on LCF:

"Ok I just clicked that and I saw Kimmers response and just realized something that bothers me. She had almost 20,000 posts in many, many threads (remember, she popped in everywhere to spread her message). I am sure there are people out there that do searches and are unaware of the controversy and could likely follow her dangerous advice.

Her avatar is still up (), her fake stats are there, all the lies in her posts are there....all that visible alongside her advice and people are going to buy it. I am not saying scrub everything...I don't think that is a good idea, but I do think a warning in the signature or something is necessary."

So let's hope LCF takes anipomoni's advice and posts a warning on all of Heidi's threads. It would be a tragedy if another person became ill because of Kimmer's scandalous advice.


LINKS:

http://www.lowcarbfriends.com/bbs/9884380-post2761.html

http://www.lowcarbfriends.com/bbs/main-lowcarb-lobby/417681-water-fasting-3.html#post6751727

Photo: http://www.bcwa-ri.com/

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MORE SHOTS FIRED !!!

In her blog post on LCF last night, ANIPOMONI, fires a round and Deni takes a direct hit:

"Quote:

Originally Posted by Awakened [aka Deni, former Kimkins poster-girl]

What you may not realize is that this whole discussion is only making her words seem more true to anyone who isn't "one of you".
.......

I know you all only want to look at her "angry" words... but I don't think it's fair to only look at someone's anger when they are trying to express themselves in a fair and balanced way. She isn't one sided and mean here.. she is pointing out the negatives AND the positives at LCF...................

I (and BEcky too for that matter) appreciate all the exposing that you have done. I know how hard you all have worked...

I've watched it play out right here on this board. But some of you may not realize that sometimes things need to stay BEHIND the scenes in order to actually accomplish things legally. Tipping of the enemy is not always the best game plan.

And when someone points out that you (the Fascination thread heros) aren't above reproach yourselves.. the first reaction is to poke fun at them and laugh at the idea that she might have a tiny bit of truth in her statements."

[ANIPOMONI]:

"I hate to say it like this, but in the grand scheme of things, you guys really didn't do much. Nothing positive anyway. You lent credibility to a fraudulent and unhealthy diet (unintentianally of course), you drove business into Heidi's pocket. If it wasn't for people here, you would probably still be on kk. Actually, if people here stopped searching for the truth every time someone wrote something negative about LCF in their journal, we probably wouldn't have gotten 5 pages in on the #1 Fascination thread.

I even remember one of you complaining of not getting all the $$ you were entitled to for affiliate leads. This was AFTER the fraud. Uhhh...hello? It's money from a fraud, why would you want it? Is that the Christian thing?

But no one brings this stuff up, because everyone here is truly not as mean as they are portrayed. Umm...except me I guess.

And don't count me as one of the "you" here. Because I am not. I am way too blunt and don't do much but lurk here (and sit on my fingers), so my views and especially the way I say them, should in no way reflect anyone here. They are all much nicer than me. "

'Quote: Originally Posted by Tooter

The problem was that we were all called haters by you guys Before your eyes were opened and Becky's post re-enforces that she still feels the same way about "Us/They".'

[ANIPOMONI]:

"Don't forget that people here were attacked at every single, solitary point on this journey. From the very beginning we were haters because we were questioning the pictures. If we (I am including myself here even though I did nothing) just backed away b/c someone said something nasty in her journal.....well, a lot of people would still be following (and working for) kimkins.

[and now I really have to catch up]

ETA: Ok I really should read on before I respond. Just read cleo's post and she totally said what I meant...but much better"

FOR CLARITY'S SAKE, HERE IS AWAKENED'S ORIGINAL POST ON LCF:

"I am probably going to regret this, but I feel that I have to say something on this whole Becky discussion.

What you may not realize is that this whole discussion is only making her words seem more true to anyone who isn't "one of you".

Her words were written ... IN HER JOUNRAL. Isn't she entitled to an opinion? Isn't she entitled to feeling angry at times or hurt or even just plain old grumpy sometimes? In the very first sentence of this "post in question" she said she was upset with LCF people for being "PART" of driving the site out of business. She didn't blame you all for taking it down.. she was mad because you all "directed" Kimmer to it. Obviously none of you knew that Kimmer was going to go and get it shut down.. and obviously none of us knew that KImmer's "reach" wasn't going to last long.

Becky is very mad at KIMMER... and on this particular day you all played a part in giving Kimmer something to get a hold of.

Becky also pointed out that the FAscination thread "has done a lot of good work". She also pointed out that she appreciates the value of the Fascination thread and the good intentions and contributions of many people there.

I know you all only want to look at her "angry" words... but I don't think it's fair to only look at someone's anger when they are trying to express themselves in a fair and balanced way. She isn't one sided and mean here.. she is pointing out the negatives AND the positives at LCF.

She doesn't say she wants the Fascination thread gone. She points out the fact that LCF has the original "HOW TO DO KIMKINS" thread there, and that people are still USING KIMKINS here. I know you all have a problem with that too don't you?

She points out that sometimes you all make remarks about people who are "innocent" in this matter. Can you honestly say that you have never said a rude comment about someone OTHER than Kimmer just to be funny? I think we have all been guilty of doing that at times, and it's wrong to excuse it and think it's okay to hurt someone's feelings "just because".

Becky constantly comes back to the point that KIMMER is the real problem here. Kimmer is who we are after. (we all agree on this right?)

She also has a very valid point in mentioning that SOMETIMES the "WAY" in which this thread goes after or ridicules anyone involved with this whole Kimkins debacle can get out of hand. And whether you would like to believe it or not... more often than not, it's the unneccessary comments that turn MANY people away from listening to your very VALID comments.

I for one can speak for myself in saying that while I was still at Kimkins.. and was totally ignorant about all of the fraud and lies and even unhealthiness... I saw this Fascination thread as a major turn off. I was insulted and disgusted by the tone that this thread often takes. And because I saw "ugliness" I was easily able to right off any "logic" and "truth" that came up inbetween personal stabs.

If it weren't for Becky, I NEVER would have considered that anything written on this site might have some truth to it. And Kimmer knows this. She plays it very well. She feeds the fire and then uses it to her benefit.

I think THIS fact is what Becky was really mad at deep inside. She has watched Heidi USE your tactics for HER benefit over and over again. And it's still happening.I know that you all are caring, strong, and very committed women. I know now that your intentions are the same as mine. (Get Kimkins shut down and Heidi in jail!) But it hurts me to see the way that you all still refuse to admit that you might be stepping on some toes along the way.

I (and BEcky too for that matter) appreciate all the exposing that you have done. I know how hard you all have worked... I've watched it play out right here on this board. But some of you may not realize that sometimes things need to stay BEHIND the scenes in order to actually accomplish things legally. Tipping of the enemy is not always the best game plan.

And when someone points out that you (the Fascination thread heros) aren't above reproach yourselves.. the first reaction is to poke fun at them and laugh at the idea that she might have a tiny bit of truth in her statements.

The saddest part for me, is that I'm actually shaking before hitting the SUBMIT button, because I know that this post might get some of you to say things about me that will hurt my feelings.

I just wish it didn't have to be this way."

AND TOOTER'S POST ON LCF:

"I am Sorry, Awaken, but I don't agree with you.

I don't think Becky is the Enemy and I don't think anyone else here thinks that. I Think she used poor judgement and was hurtful to the very people who saved her butt. I think the other thing that bothers people about this whole thing is that we were to be silent about it. Just like people were with Kimmer. Becky's post came through as "Do As I say and Not as I do".

You don't Vent in a Journal that is public and expect not to offend the people you are talking about. If you truly want something private, you do it in private. Not on a public board. She should have had a private Journal to do her venting.

Then when 2Big4Mysize went to her and tried to reason with her on how it sounded to everyone...She excused and justified her own behavior and people in her own thread were "Yes" people and "Haters" again. Jumped all over 2Big4Mysize. Brings back alot of Kimmer memories for all of us.

As I said before in this thread, Everyone gets burned out, and everyone has said things that they shouldn't at those times. And I do mean "EVERYONE".

The difference is, I see alot of apologies in this thread. I see nothing from Becky.

In the scheme of things, this will be old news by next week. People will still work with her. They just might not have the respect that they once had.That's her choice. If she wants to preach a "Standard" the first thing she must do is live by that Standard.

I think the biggest thing that is upsetting everyone on here and in the Blogs is that She is allowed to say whatever she wants, but we aren't. She's not the hater, WE are.

To people who actually fought for the truth Long before she got involved, that's a huge smack in the face. To say we can't react to that, is another.

Like I said, this will be old news in a few days. The choice is hers in how this all will be remembered."

Anipomoni and Tooter...thank you for stepping into the line of fire and shooting from the hip. Kudos to you both.

LINK TO ANIPOMONI'S POST:

http://www.lowcarbfriends.com/bbs/9653617-post2972.html

LINK TO AWAKENED'S POST:

http://www.lowcarbfriends.com/bbs/9648994-post2727.html

LINK TO TOOTER'S POST:

http://www.lowcarbfriends.com/bbs/9649102-post2728.html

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MORGAN B*TCH-SLAPS BECKY & SETS THE RECORD STRAIGHT !!!

MorganMacLeoid delivers a knock-out punch to Becky!

Here's a portion of Morgan's post on LCF:

"[SNIP]

As for Becky.. I just read her post(s) at the other forum and my jaw hit the desk. First her portrayal of people here at LCF was so totally off the mark and very uncool.

But worse was her next post about "I have done this! and I have done that! and I have done this! and I have done that!" Umm.. yeah ok. No one else has done those things and more? I can go down the list and check them all off aside from exposing Heidi's emails as I never had any emails from Heidi. But I have done everything else on that list as MANY others here have as well. Enough with the martyr contest already, geeze.

We here, well most of us here, were in this long before she "came over to the light" (lol). We had already invested months into the investigation and leg work of it all.. none of that counts? We're all haters? What?

As many of you here may know, I am one of the anti kimkins bloggers. One of the first ones (third actually I think that got any notice at all). I don't tell anyone which blog or give my name on my blog because I don't want to be a martyr or be one of the "untouchables" or anything. I just want this woman stopped and I was highly offended by Becky's posts.So.. anyway.. enough of that.. [SNIP]"

Later on in the thread, Sherrie lc comments on Morgan's post:

"But not only that, all of us here (LCF, blogs etc) worked just as hard, a lot of us have been at it from the beginning when NO-ONE would listen to us and call us haters. When it wasn't cool to be anti-kimmer, not even on LCF, when we had to find proof for everything, cross every t and dot every i, not have it given to us.We were constantly called names and criticised and frankly if we all didn't keep the pressure on everyone when it wasn't cool, they would still be there. Jimmy would still be there, Becky still be there, Christin, Deni etc etc and Kimmer would be much, much richer and a lot more people would be sick, maybe worse. We had nothing to gain by doing this, we just did it because we cared, we saw BS and called them out on it because enough was enough, so we took the hits on the chin and soldiered on.

I say we all deserve a pat on the back, good for us!!!

But another thing that bothered me is 2big, this is someone whom could've come here or to one of the blogs to b*tch about it but instead she chose to go straight to the horses mouth to share her concerns and her head was bitten off for it? Whether they agree with what she said or not, it was nothing viscous or malice, it didn't deserve the reaction it got, they could have talked to her maturely about it rather then just dismiss her like her feelings don't mean anything. To be honest it all reminded me of the old kimmer threads here."

AND THE REASON MORGAN and SHERRIE LC are so upset?

Although I am loathe to post this, it's necessary in order to understand Morgan and Sherrie's comments: From BECKY, formerly of Kimkins):

"And, btw, if anyone has a right to be upset with Kimmer, I do. She lied to me and used me in a way that only a few others in this drama have experienced. (I'm not saying I got the worst, not at all, but I am one of a handful who really got up close and personal in this.)

If anyone has proven they are working to bring Kimmer down, I have.

I initiated the first collaborative email showdown with Kimmer that got her to trip herself up in print.

I quit my job, gave up income and a potential business, and spend many unpaid hours to expose Heidi Diaz and her site now.

I followed up and communicated with all the original Admins who served with me, and helped to persuade them that Kimmer was a dangerous fraud and we needed to quit.

Together with a couple of others, I personally contacted all the second and third groups of Admins she brought in to replace the first of us who left, and persuaded them not to take the position, or to quit.

I am the one who tipped the blogs to the very first found Russian bride, thanks to Cilantro's good work and her telling me first.

I tipped TheTRUTH to much of what was posted there, thanks to key players working undercover at my behest.

I have tipped several of the blogs to a lot of things, in fact. I have also opposed overt maliciousness in the blogs, too, like was leveled against Christin, Deni, KimATC, SingingLass, etc.I have done the legal things we were asked to do, like lawsuit, BBB review, petition, etc.

I have communicated with KTLA reporter Chip Yost, Morning Show producer CJ Lenat, etc.

I am in contact with the attorney almost every day, and supply a lot of info to him.

I also find out a lot from him that I am not telling anyone.

I put Jeannie in touch with the attorney, and helped to make that connection.

I also listened to her with respect, as a fellow human, and took the time to understand her viewpoints, even if i do not always agree.

And I have BEGGED people on both sides to think things through, try to understand all sides, speak with integrity, and behave with dignity and respect.

I admit, I have slammed Kimmer hard, but not falsely or maliciously. (Well, except for the time I called her a freakin' liar, which she is.) But, as far as I recall, I have not been unkind to anyone else.

Anyway, I feel I have earned the right to speak my mind on this, and have my opinions heard."


Although it is taking a great deal of effort on my part, I will refrain from posting my thoughts on Becky's post at this time. That's not to say, however, that I won't let fly in the future.


TO READ BECKY'S FIRST POST THAT STARTED THE BALL ROLLING, CLICK HERE:

BECKY GETS SPANKED...HARD...


LINK TO MORGAN'S POST ON LCF:
http://www.lowcarbfriends.com/bbs/9647935-post2672.html

LINK TO SHERRIE LC'S POST ON LCF:
http://www.lowcarbfriends.com/bbs/9648414-post2703.html

*Photo: barnard.columbia.edu

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BECKY GETS SPANKED...HARD...

In a post yesterday on Kimkins Exhausted, Team Yucky delivered this stinging rebuke to Becky, formerly of Kimkins:

"thank you Becky

16 December, 2007...

We here at Team Yucky have just learned of Becky’s sermon (titled, “I Am Actually Very Upset’”) which she preached from the pulpit over at The First Jimmy Church & now let us pray:

O Becky. Thank you.

Thank you for insulting the people who were working to bring Kimmer to justice while you were busy spreading her gospel of starvation.

Thank you for denouncing the people who knew the truth & tried to tell it while you were busy helping Kimmer silence them.

Thank you for minimizing the months & months of hard work, intelligent work, honest work, by the countless armchair activists such as HoneyBee & the other Nancy Drews at LCF, ALC & the blogs, the behind-the-scenes googlers, organizers, campaigners, the emailers, the phone callers, the petitioners, those who lobbied the media & the state and federal authorities, those who continue the fight, providing files of evidence & working on the rankings, pleading with the affiliates, persuading the sponsors — all those people who did and continue to do, the work which you & others refused for so long to do, and now refuse to honor because you’re a saint & saints can’t be seen in such ragged company. Vile wretches we, with our “ugly noise,” our “nonsense,” and our rough & rowdy ways.

And thank you, Becky, for not knowing what the hell you’re talking about. Nobody at LCF or anywhere else, including any of the blogs, drove the magic chicken diet pushers out of business. None of us “helped destroy her business.”

None of us have that kind of power with GoDaddy.

If the chicken diet people didn’t pay their bill, how exactly are LCF, the posters, the bloggers or anybody else responsible for that?

If Kimmer convinced GoDaddy to lock down the chicken diet website, how exactly are LCF, the posters, the bloggers or anybody else responsible for that?

If the chicken diet guy took out a help wanted ad at getafreelancer specifying that he wanted “a clone of Kimkins.com” how exactly are LCF, the posters, the bloggers or anybody else responsible for that?

If the chicken diet lady spent “thousands of dollars” on a website instead of spending the money on surgery, how exactly are LCF, the posters, the bloggers or anybody else responsible for that?

If God told the chicken diet lady to go into business without benefit of qualified legal counsel, how exactly are LCF, the posters, the bloggers or anybody else responsible for that?

And if the chicken diet is as dangerous as Kimkins how exactly are LCF, the posters, the bloggers or anybody else responsible for that?

Most of all, Becky, thank you for reminding us not to put you or anybody else up on a pedestal.

Amen.

Sincerely,
Team Yucky"

UPDATE:

Becky's original post:

"I am actually very upset with the LCF people and the blogs for being part of driving that site out of business. In fact, I am furious!

They can like it or not, but she was not a fraud, she was successful and real, and was well within her rights to start a business selling her diet. Contrary to their misinformed opinion, anyone can sell a diet,without a doctor or nutritionist affiliated, as long as it is within minimal safe legal standards, which hers was (and Kimkins isn't). She stated up front what the diet was better than Kimmer did (low carb, lowcal, low fat), offered more support and more caution than Kimmer did,and kept calories higher, up within the range of MANY commercial diets that operate freely and unimpeded. The site cost her money she may or may not have recouped, and it certainly deprived her overnight of a stream of revenue she no doubt counted on. She has lost her business(and hopes of funding reconstructive surgery, apparently) right before what should have been her busiest season.

If they are opposed to anyone making money off of diet support, there goes entire sections of every bookstore in the country, and just about every diet board online, because they all make money to pay the bills somehow, whether in selling information, support services, ad space, or products.

If they think it is wrong to sell something without ALL the details being known first, they had better get appointed head of the FTC, and pull down half the marketing out there on the web. Better yet, become a majority in Congress, and change the rules. FALSE information, like Kimmer gave, is illegal. Withholding disclosure of info required by law is illegal. What the chicken site did is lawful marketing, whether we like it or not.

This was important to her, and a mere passing fancy to many of them, and they helped to destroy her business.

If it had had anything to do with Kimmer, WHY would the guy have taken out an ad for a freelancer to make it like the Kimkins site? After all,Heidi OWNS Kimkins, has the tech team that BUILT Kimkins, and could use that template to pop up another in a flash.

Congratulations. They ended up doing Kimmer's dirty work for her, and managing to get her competition shut down.

They will not rest, apparently, until Tippy's site and this lady's site and anyplace else current Kimkins members might _really_ fell warmly welcomed is gone.

Yet they are patting each other on the back and doing the happy dance. I am disgusted.

Furthermore, LCF still has the Kimkins diet there, with many Kimkins threads devoted to it. If the Magic Chicken Lady was dangerous, what about LCF? True, there is the Fascination thread, which has done a lot of good work, but the rest is also still there, too, and nothing to stop people from following it as Kimmer always promoted it. Tippy's new site and the Magic Chicken site both have better bottom limits than that.

On top of that, they did to the Chicken Diet lady what they did to Tippy, and others --- insulted her looks, questioned her intelligence,mocked her spelling and grammar (and that of her family), and cast aspersions on her character, her intentions and her other dealings, on the merest of suspicions, with scanty evidence. Debate over evidence is one thing, but ad hominum attacks are uncalled for.

They have even had a go at Hector Diaz, remarking that 'maybe his elevator doesn't go all the way to the top floor'. He has been willing and able to participate in providing valuable info to the proper people,and he comes under attack? Out of line!

I appreciate the value of the Fascination threads, and the good intentions and contributions of many people there. However, this out-of-control nonsense is exactly why many people (including Tippy)didn't listen to them over Kimmer. The true message gets lost in the ugly noise.

Heidi is the true, deliberate scammer here. Every other player, to some extent, has been duped and used.

The ends do not always justify the means.

We are wading into people's hopes and dreams and fears and very identity and self-definition. Shame on us if we trample and misuse and exploit that!Then we are doing to them what Heidi Diaz has already done.

It is wrong to re-victimize the victims, just to make our case!

Now, they can have a go at me, if they like."


~~~~~~


Yucky, word has it that many are appalled by Becky's slamming post.


Comments? Anyone?


LINK TO TEAM YUCKY'S POST:


http://yustyucky.wordpress.com/2007/12/16/thank-you-becky/#comment-309

*Photo above from the movie "Behave Yourself"

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KIMKINS PIN-UPS FOUND !!! AT CAMP CARBAWAY !!!

Missing-in-Action Kimkins.com pin-ups, Brian and Heather, have been found!

Magicswoman, uber LCF detective, reported the following on my blog post MISSING PERSONS ALERT! KIMKINS PIN-UP COUPLE MISSING !!! :


Magicsmom said...

"Medusa, Brian and Heather are running the Camp Carbaway site. He is the one who created it, and he's the administrator.
December 15, 2007 1:05 AM"

Thank you, Magicsmom! We were worried sick about them.

And from our amazing HoneyBee on LCF:

"Yes, they [Brian & Heather] have been involved from day one. I think I posted on that when I posted about TT's new site. But I didn't share this at the time....the domain of campcarbaway was originally owned by Heather. It seems that it was purchased/transferred to Tippy just prior to TT starting her blog.

*Heather and Brian are no longer on kimkins as of today. They were both banned within a few minutes of asking to be removed off the front page of kimkins.com.

So even though they may have CampCarbaway..... I wanted to saythey also now belong to BANNED CAMP!"

[SNIP]

"...They were not a success yet, therefore they had no value to Heidi anymore once they left kimkins.com."

SO Tippy Toes (Jeannie Baitinger) has purloined 2 more rising stars from Kimkins.com. Heidi must be wild. Bet my last dollar that Heidi and the Cap'n are drowning their sorrows.


AND word on the street has it that Brian and Heather are running Tippy's forums and that our Fawn (yes, the adorable camp-follower, fawning Fawn....huggiesssssssssssssss!) is also spreading the love on those forums. That would be enough to send me running wildly through the woods at Camp Carbaway.

Heidi! Fawn seems to be workin' both you and Tippy. Feeling betrayed, angry, insulted? Well, hopefully you do because now you know how ex-Kimkinites you banned feel. Oh, hold on now. Silly me. How could you possibly feel any of those emotions? Sociopaths have no empathy, do they?

Must be lonely at the top, Heidi. Feel a little like Captain Queeg?

READ MARIASOL'S BLOG FOR MORE ON BRIAN & HEATHER'S JUMPING SHIP! CLICK HERE: Mariasol

LINK TO HONEYBEE'S BLOG & POST ON LCF:
HoneyBee's Blog
http://www.lowcarbfriends.com/bbs/9636733-post2467.html

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NEWS FLASH! KIMMER PHOTO IS BOGUS!

Those who have been following the Many Faces of Kimmer are most likely familiar with the purported grainy picture of her in a white dress (second from left), allegedly taken approximately 26 years ago (in or around 1981) at a wedding.

Well, lo and behold, on LCF today a new poster, highdesertgal, had this to say about the "white dress" photo of Heidi Diaz/Kimmer:

"I've never entered a chat room before and don't know if I'm posting this correctly. I've been reading these threads and comments about Heidi Diaz since October when her diet scam was brought to my attention.

I knew Heidi when she was married to Hector, we lived in the same town. I have also met Hector's second wife, after they got custody of Brandon. The photo of "Kimmer" in the white dress you are all talking about is NOT Heidi. She has never been thin, not ever. It is clearly a photo of a model. The other photo in the blue/white dress at the zoo is Heidi with a very young Brandon. Just wanted to clear this up.' (bolding mine)


Sooooooooooo....the "white dress" Kimmer is NOT Heidi Diaz/Kimmer AND Heidi Diaz/Kimmer has never been thin.

Quelle surprise!

LINK at LCF:

http://www.lowcarbfriends.com/bbs/9630314-post2249.html

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AN EXAMINATION & DISSECTION OF TIPPY TOES' *NEW* APOLOGY...

.....by JoanieOrchard at LCF:

NOTE: All quotes in green below are from Tippy Toes' new apology, the body of which you will find in the next post down in my blog.

"Snippets of Flippy:

Quote:
For the rest reading this I just wanted to make one thing clear. I do not believe the Kimkins diet is harmful if medically supervised and with proper supplements and calories over 800 (more is better). I am sorry if this is offensive but I just cannot lie about it. I have lost over 68 lbs on Kimkins in cycle rounds. What is wrong with Kimkins, in my opinion, is pushing the plan behind the plan, cutting calories lower and lower... This I do believe is extremely dangerous and I would never advise such.

I’m so glad you clarified your position on Kimkins. It’s important to me to know what you believe. And your credentials are … ? Oh, I forgot you were subcontracting as the PR Director for Kimkins for two months. What else is on your resume? What are your other qualifications? And since we all know that Heidi has no medical/nutritional credentials to design a diet program, you must think that you do since your opinions are supposed to be so valuable. So what are those credentials? The nutrionist on the M & J Show wasn't too impressed with your credentials. Maybe because you didn't have any?

You offer us a critique of Kimkins and your disapproval of the plan behind the plan. Where do you think the plan behind the plan came from? Now, come on, you know Kimmer advocated all that crap before Kimkins.com was even started. Anyone (you) who went to Kimkins.com from LCF knew exactly what the diet was about, and anyone (you) who feigns ignorance and innocence about the plan behind the plan is being conveniently forgetful. The plan behind the plan was/is Kimkins.

Quote:
My problem with Kimkins is not the diet. It is the founder, the starvation advice I now know that was previously given by her and the dishonesty that followed.

You now know? You didn’t know about the starvation advice that she offered when she was on LCF? You didn’t know about that advice when you followed her to Kimkins? You didn’t know about that advice when Christin left Kimkins, and Becky left Kimkins, and Deni left Kimkins? You didn’t know about that advice when it was posted, for all to see, on LCF and on Kimkins? You didn’t know about that advice when there were multiple fascination threads on LCF and hundreds of other boards and blogs? You went on television three weeks ago to promote Kimkins, and you didn't know that Heidi offered starvation advice? As PR Director, there sure was an awful lot that you didn’t know. You might want to leave that PR job off your resume. It doesn’t speak highly of your skills.

Quote:
I have a problem that she is accepting money from new members knowing her site is (in her words) unstable. I feel bad for existing members who may soon find themselves with no home base or support.

As recently as a month ago, you didn’t have a problem when people paid 49.95 as long as your money was paid every month. Seems a little suspicious that you didn’t get this compassionate awareness until your money stopped coming in.

Quote:
I do apologize to Christin and Deni. I am very sorry I accused you both of setting poor examples as moderators. I now understand you were following the advice and orders from a woman you thought was 118lbs and on maintenance for 5 years. Please forgive me.

You now understand? Exactly WHAT caused this epiphany on your part? Was it when the paychecks stopped?

Quote:
As far as scrubbing the site I have no idea what people really mean by that.

Oh for heaven’s sake. Why is it that when you don’t want to be honest about
something, your posts are littered with “I don’t know” and “I don’t understand”.

Quote:
I ask that you try to have patience for Kimkins members. This is not going to be easy for them should the site close.

When have we not had patience with Kimkins members? Any time someone comes here, as a former Kimkins member, they are embraced. You’re trying to come across as someone very concerned about the Kimkins members. Too bad you weren’t concerned when Kimkins members were being thrown off the site when their only infraction was to voice a concern or a difference of opinion. Those people needed support too, but you obviously weren’t too concerned about them. Whether you personally pushed the ban button is not the issue. As long as your money continued to come in, you did nothing to stand up for the members that you now claim to care so much about.

It's obvious that you don't 'get it' and that speaks volumes about your character."

Thank you, JoanieOrchard, for your excellent dissection. JoanieOrchard's original post on LCF can be found here:

http://www.lowcarbfriends.com/bbs/9608770-post1594.html

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WHY FOCUS ON TIPPY TOES?

THIS IS WHY...

"Avenue Girl said...

By allowing Tippy to quietly slip out the back door, would just send the wrong message to anyone else who gets the brilliant idea to work for a scam artist who has pulled a big con on over 20,000 people.

Kimmer/Heidi Diaz/her boss lied to her numerous times about who she was. When Tippy found out about the lies, she continued to stay and support the fraud. I don't know about you, but If I found out my boss was lying to me, I would've been long gone. There were good people in there who were admins, who took the cue to go as soon as they realized the harm the site was causing. This sent a very clear message to the followers that were in there. They wondered where their friends went and why they left.

Tippy stayed, and tried to create a "cycling" option. She was offering an experiment that had not been fully tested. Maybe her cycling technique would have worked. But here again we have people selling things they have no right to be selling and pushing. We have no scientific proof that this is a good thing to do to your body. Even she admitted there was no doctor on board that had approved the plans that were in effect.

Currently it appears it took a massive pay cut for her to see the light. What message does that send for her reasons to jump the fence? She could have easily still supported what she was doing with the diet and got a real job. And she could have denounced the diet as soon as she heard the lies. No one was forcing her to stay.

Tippy has made her own bed.

I initially made the mistake myself thinking Kimkins is ok, fat kimmy made me skinny. I was about to start promoting again, as I had done well as an affiliate. I took the time to find out why this was not a good idea. I knew the message I would be sending would not be a very good one. It was not out of fear of what others would say that I decided not to promote. It was out of respect for myself, and the message I wanted to send to other people. I would rather be broke and able to sleep at night than rich and selling snake oil.

Tippy's message reads: I will work on a sinking ship as long as I'm getting paid for it. Stop paying me and I will send a few canons your way.

I appreciate any help Tippy can give us - It's just going to be very hard to trust her after the message she has sent. Actions."

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Avenue Girl said...

"What ELSE do you guys want her to do? To say that she IS VERY VERY sorry for what she has done?"

Yes. But not unless she means it. I want her to realize the full scope of her part in this scam. I think there is great potential for Tippy to help us really make a dent in taking down the site. Things she may say now can have a huge impact on who is still in the site. I personally comment not for drama, but because I care.

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"Avenue Girl said...

[SNIP]....But I will warn you now, as I will warn Tippy too - Anything and everything she has published on the web in the past will be used by the nay sayers to question Tippy and her diet. Before jumping on the Tippy bandwagon, I will be digging to find the true character and integrity of Ms. Toes. If she is innocent, then she has nothing to fear.'"

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"Magicsmom said...

Team Tippy, you must be a team of one. It's a lonely job, but if it's how you feel, go for it. You are far in the minority. If there are others, let them show themselves. If she is "righting the wrongs" tell us exactly how she is accomplishing it. What has she done to right the wrongs? All I've seen her do is defend herself and accept no responsibility for her complicity in Heidi's crimes. Hey come to think of it, I haven't even see her admit that Heidi committed any crimes. How do you right a wrong that you won't acknowledge?

Anonymous, having TT say she is very very sorry is like hearing Bill Clinton tell the nation he did not have sex with that woman. Telling people what they want to hear is easy, so she can save it. What we want to see is action. If she means that she is sorry, she'd better ante up and kick in to help bring Kimkins down.

You do err in assuming that TT has done nothing to hurt people personally. She has hurt many individuals. My beef with her is not about what she did at KK, it's what she did at LCF that had her banned, and what she did before that. This woman is evil, and anyone who does not believe that can have the pleasure of learning it the hard way. She didn't "make mistakes" at LCF. She stirred up trouble and lots of it. She sent e-mails and PMs to people about other people with the express intent to get people mad at each other. Then she got to stand back and watch the fireworks she created. She is still using high school tactics to cause trouble. What do I want her to do? I want her to disappear from the internet - find some other people's lives to mess with. We have had our fill of the drama that is called Tippy Toes, a.k.a. Jeannie Baitinger. As a very wise Admin at LCF said, "I forgive you - now go away!"

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"anonymous said:

Tippy Toes personally hurt me. Tippy Toes bad mouthed me to several people and drove a wedge between me and others, then laughed about it. Tippy Toes told me things before she took the job at Kimkins. She is not exempt from blame because she joined the Kimkins team AFTER the fraud was confirmed. She knew Kimmer was a fraud but took the job anyway. She lied on TV in front of thousands of people and I can prove it.

Tippy Toes will never get her reputation back because of everything she did. She was not scammed, she was one of the scammers. She has lied, played with people, pretended friendship and then backstabbed those friends. It will be very hard to forgive her. Do unto others as you will have those do unto you. Do you think Tippy wants us all to treat her as she has treated the people of LCF and Kimkins? I doubt it because frankly what shes done to people is reprehensible. Some of you were not recieving end of all the hateful things she had done, count yourself lucky.

If Tippy starts a site of her own then I hope it is a FREE site. If she charges then she is no better then Kimmer because I know its all about money for Tippy and if she does create a site for money I will come forward with everything that I know and she will be along side of Kimmer. Its funny how you say shes helped thousdands of people. Your head seems just as big as hers." (BOLDING MINE)

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